Comments on: Ron Paul vs. Rudy Giuliani http://www.healthcarebs.com/2007/07/31/ron-paul-vs-rudy-giuliani/ Cleaning the Augean Stables of the Health Care Debate Thu, 08 Jan 2009 22:59:41 +0000 http://wordpress.org/?v=2.3.3 By: Ricky http://www.healthcarebs.com/2007/07/31/ron-paul-vs-rudy-giuliani/#comment-5239 Ricky Thu, 09 Aug 2007 06:39:54 +0000 http://www.healthcarebs.com/2007/07/31/ron-paul-vs-rudy-giuliani/#comment-5239 I'm all for Ron Paul, but keep in mind that Rudy did help take new york from a bad condition, to a much better one. Some more good debates between candidates will help resolve any concerns. I’m all for Ron Paul, but keep in mind that Rudy did help take new york from a bad condition, to a much better one. Some more good debates between candidates will help resolve any concerns.

]]> By: Ron Holland http://www.healthcarebs.com/2007/07/31/ron-paul-vs-rudy-giuliani/#comment-4950 Ron Holland Wed, 01 Aug 2007 11:54:07 +0000 http://www.healthcarebs.com/2007/07/31/ron-paul-vs-rudy-giuliani/#comment-4950 Giuliani the former Fed prosecutor, mayor of NYC and head of Giuliani Partners "is more free market than Ron Paul", give me a break. He has spent his entire life at the government trough feeding on the tax revenues of productive members of society. The free market is always superior to top down government and political actions. Giuliani the former Fed prosecutor, mayor of NYC and head of Giuliani Partners “is more free market than Ron Paul”,
give me a break. He has spent his entire life at the government trough feeding on the tax revenues of productive members of society.

The free market is always superior to top down government and political actions.

]]> By: C. Wesley Fowler http://www.healthcarebs.com/2007/07/31/ron-paul-vs-rudy-giuliani/#comment-4943 C. Wesley Fowler Wed, 01 Aug 2007 05:52:42 +0000 http://www.healthcarebs.com/2007/07/31/ron-paul-vs-rudy-giuliani/#comment-4943 I agree Dondero, you and David should keep in touch. You seem to be about equally inclined to expose your ignorance and agenda. 2 peas in a pod, clearly. Now get busy David, you need to hurry and delete the posts here which don't tow the line! I'd be sure to delete Dondero's as well if I were you. Anyone who looks at that blog of Dondero's and associates him with you will pay a lot less attention to your spastic opinions. I agree Dondero, you and David should keep in touch. You seem to be about equally inclined to expose your ignorance and agenda.

2 peas in a pod, clearly. Now get busy David, you need to hurry and delete the posts here which don’t tow the line! I’d be sure to delete Dondero’s as well if I were you. Anyone who looks at that blog of Dondero’s and associates him with you will pay a lot less attention to your spastic opinions.

]]> By: Kevin Houston http://www.healthcarebs.com/2007/07/31/ron-paul-vs-rudy-giuliani/#comment-4938 Kevin Houston Wed, 01 Aug 2007 03:49:06 +0000 http://www.healthcarebs.com/2007/07/31/ron-paul-vs-rudy-giuliani/#comment-4938 Julie-Annie? A Libertarian? BWahahahahaha Julie-Annie is for <B><I>Public Funding</I></B> of Abortions! You can't get anymore non-libertarian than that. Setting aside the immorality of abortion for just a moment, no libertarian would agree that it should be publically funded. Rudy tries to justify his position by saying that if it’s a Constitutional right, then the public should pay for it. http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=QZe1j4csMq8 HUH?!? Shall we now have public funding for people who want to own guns but can’t afford to? Not during Giuliani time. During Giuliani time, we bring lawsuits against gun manufacturers... Besides which who cares which of them is more Libertarian, this is the <i>Republican</i> nomination we are contesting for. If it makes you feel better, I am prepared to concede that Ron Paul is more <i>Republican</i> than Julie-Annie. (You would then be free to assume that Julie-Annie is therefore more Libertarian.) :) Later. Julie-Annie? A Libertarian?

BWahahahahaha

Julie-Annie is for Public Funding of Abortions! You can’t get anymore non-libertarian than that. Setting aside the immorality of abortion for just a moment, no libertarian would agree that it should be publically funded. Rudy tries to justify his position by saying that if it’s a Constitutional right, then the public should pay for it.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=QZe1j4csMq8

HUH?!?

Shall we now have public funding for people who want to own guns but can’t afford to? Not during Giuliani time. During Giuliani time, we bring lawsuits against gun manufacturers…

Besides which who cares which of them is more Libertarian, this is the Republican nomination we are contesting for. If it makes you feel better, I am prepared to concede that Ron Paul is more Republican than Julie-Annie. (You would then be free to assume that Julie-Annie is therefore more Libertarian.) :)

Later.

]]> By: Mr. Moderate http://www.healthcarebs.com/2007/07/31/ron-paul-vs-rudy-giuliani/#comment-4935 Mr. Moderate Wed, 01 Aug 2007 03:30:41 +0000 http://www.healthcarebs.com/2007/07/31/ron-paul-vs-rudy-giuliani/#comment-4935 For all the free market talk, I wonder why people keep thinking that the market will produce affordable health insurance for sick people. It doesn't provide affordable car insurance for drivers who keep getting into wrecks. It doesn't provide affordable flood insurance for people who live in a flood plains. It doesn't make sense that it will produce affordable health insurance for the people that need it most. It isn't a moral judgement of the market, it's a fact of the amoral nature of markets. If that is what we want, so be it. But let's not be under the illusion that market forces will magically make affordable insurance for the elderly and people with chronic or terminal diseases. For all the free market talk, I wonder why people keep thinking that the market will produce affordable health insurance for sick people. It doesn’t provide affordable car insurance for drivers who keep getting into wrecks. It doesn’t provide affordable flood insurance for people who live in a flood plains. It doesn’t make sense that it will produce affordable health insurance for the people that need it most. It isn’t a moral judgement of the market, it’s a fact of the amoral nature of markets. If that is what we want, so be it. But let’s not be under the illusion that market forces will magically make affordable insurance for the elderly and people with chronic or terminal diseases.

]]> By: Matt http://www.healthcarebs.com/2007/07/31/ron-paul-vs-rudy-giuliani/#comment-4927 Matt Tue, 31 Jul 2007 21:04:47 +0000 http://www.healthcarebs.com/2007/07/31/ron-paul-vs-rudy-giuliani/#comment-4927 The irony of a Giuliani fan lecturing others on libertarian principles is lost on no one. The irony of a Giuliani fan lecturing others on libertarian principles is lost on no one.

]]> By: To_Rule_is_2_Destroy http://www.healthcarebs.com/2007/07/31/ron-paul-vs-rudy-giuliani/#comment-4922 To_Rule_is_2_Destroy Tue, 31 Jul 2007 19:43:09 +0000 http://www.healthcarebs.com/2007/07/31/ron-paul-vs-rudy-giuliani/#comment-4922 "We see only the oppressive side of authority. Maybe it comes out of our history and our background. What we don't see is that freedom is not a concept in which people can do anything they want, be anything they can be. Freedom is about authority. Freedom is about the willingness of every single human being to cede to lawful authority a great deal of discretion about what you do...At the core the struggle is philosophical. There are many, many things that can be done in law enforcement to protect us better. There are many things that can done to create a government that is more responsive and more helpful." Rudy Guiliani Thats not a pretty libertarian statement if you ask me. Personally I think Rudy's free market approaches will amount too nothing. I don't think understands free markets. He's never really worked in the private sector, never ran a business. His whole career has been spent in Gov't, until the last few years when he joined an already established law firm. They used his name to attract big corporate accounts, usually at the behest of them gaining some kind of government contract. End in the end Rudy's policies will be to Haliburtionize health care for the poor, and he'll call the free market, and tell us how he made the government more helpful. I just don't see how you can rip Dr. Paul, when most of the libertarian establishment, supports him and about 90% of his positions. I would bet in the cases of medicare patients, he just did the work for free. He was the only OB/GYN in that county at one point, and refusing to accept medicare is unlawful. The next thing you'll rip him for is taking the pro-bono work off his taxes, I guess. But hey go ahead an support the gun grabber if you feel you must. “We see only the oppressive side of authority. Maybe it comes out of our history and our background. What we don’t see is that freedom is not a concept in which people can do anything they want, be anything they can be. Freedom is about authority. Freedom is about the willingness of every single human being to cede to lawful authority a great deal of discretion about what you do…At the core the struggle is philosophical. There are many, many things that can be done in law enforcement to protect us better. There are many things that can done to create a government that is more responsive and more helpful.”
Rudy Guiliani
Thats not a pretty libertarian statement if you ask me.

Personally I think Rudy’s free market approaches will amount too nothing. I don’t think understands free markets. He’s never really worked in the private sector, never ran a business. His whole career has been spent in Gov’t, until the last few years when he joined an already established law firm. They used his name to attract big corporate accounts, usually at the behest of them gaining some kind of government contract. End in the end Rudy’s policies will be to Haliburtionize health care for the poor, and he’ll call the free market, and tell us how he made the government more helpful.
I just don’t see how you can rip Dr. Paul, when most of the libertarian establishment, supports him and about 90% of his positions. I would bet in the cases of medicare patients, he just did the work for free. He was the only OB/GYN in that county at one point, and refusing to accept medicare is unlawful. The next thing you’ll rip him for is taking the pro-bono work off his taxes, I guess. But hey go ahead an support the gun grabber if you feel you must.

]]> By: Eric Dondero http://www.healthcarebs.com/2007/07/31/ron-paul-vs-rudy-giuliani/#comment-4919 Eric Dondero Tue, 31 Jul 2007 18:48:23 +0000 http://www.healthcarebs.com/2007/07/31/ron-paul-vs-rudy-giuliani/#comment-4919 It's now up at www.libertarianrepublican.blogspot.com Thanks David. Let's stay in touch! It’s now up at http://www.libertarianrepublican.blogspot.com

Thanks David. Let’s stay in touch!

]]> By: Ray http://www.healthcarebs.com/2007/07/31/ron-paul-vs-rudy-giuliani/#comment-4917 Ray Tue, 31 Jul 2007 17:16:40 +0000 http://www.healthcarebs.com/2007/07/31/ron-paul-vs-rudy-giuliani/#comment-4917 Giving people $15,000 tax breaks for health care is stupid because its not free market and its essentially what has our system so screwed up in the first place. If you let people deduct up to 15k they have a strong incentive to buy 15k worth or insurance. This is what alot of corporations do allready because of the tax deductions, they buy super expensive policies. These are not true insurance they have rediculously low premiums like $30-50. Patient no longer have any incentive to control cost and since its through the insurance companies the doctors just charge the maximum amount. Welcome to the rise of the HMOs. This is a scheme by guiliani to get every american family to give an HMO $15k because it wont cost them anything because they can deduct it from their taxes. But in reality everything cost something, the federal goverment will loose revenue and have to raise taxes and the HMOs will make out like bandits and we will still be stuck with the same corporate medicine we have now instead of true free market reform like Dr. Paul proposes. Giving people $15,000 tax breaks for health care is stupid because its not free market and its essentially what has our system so screwed up in the first place. If you let people deduct up to 15k they have a strong incentive to buy 15k worth or insurance. This is what alot of corporations do allready because of the tax deductions, they buy super expensive policies. These are not true insurance they have rediculously low premiums like $30-50. Patient no longer have any incentive to control cost and since its through the insurance companies the doctors just charge the maximum amount. Welcome to the rise of the HMOs. This is a scheme by guiliani to get every american family to give an HMO $15k because it wont cost them anything because they can deduct it from their taxes. But in reality everything cost something, the federal goverment will loose revenue and have to raise taxes and the HMOs will make out like bandits and we will still be stuck with the same corporate medicine we have now instead of true free market reform like Dr. Paul proposes.

]]> By: Catron http://www.healthcarebs.com/2007/07/31/ron-paul-vs-rudy-giuliani/#comment-4913 Catron Tue, 31 Jul 2007 15:52:26 +0000 http://www.healthcarebs.com/2007/07/31/ron-paul-vs-rudy-giuliani/#comment-4913 Eric, by all means have at it. Eric, by all means have at it.

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